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forum Forum index forumOn the Bench forumEngland and Pakistan cricket fiasco

Author : Topic: England and Pakistan cricket fiasco  Bottom
 Fles
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 Fles
  Posted 22/08/2006 04:47:35 PM
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Where do i start, what a complete shambles.  The first ever test in a 129 years to be forfeited speaks volumes.

The on field stuff was sad enough.  The umpire is quite in his rights to take action if he suspects ball tampering.  Pakistan were quite in their right to defend themselves, but the petulent half hour sit in after the tea break just makes me shake my head.  Why not play out the last sesion and work it out at the end of play like they do for all other issues?  Whatever happened to accepting the umps decision on field and getting on with it?  How many big decisions go against sportsmen and teams each week?  Anyone that has played, coached or spectated has felt the pain of tough calls whether right or wrong, its frustrating.  With all the World Cup football cockups recently, thankfully we didn't see teams sitting in the change rooms for half an hour after the restart sulking.  The great example out oif this is that if we don't like a mjor decision, we hold the game to ransom.

More astounding out of all of this is the race card play.  The crys of Mr 'Hair' being racist towards asian players is quite incredible.  I read Rashid Latif's racist vitreol last night and it left me just pissed off to be a fan of cricket.  The claims he treats non asian players differently by not talking much and having a lack of communication with them.  Have the same people watched his games here.  He is like that to all players, he is no  Dicky Bird or Billy Bowden.  i watch cricket on pay Tv all over the world, the racist thing is just crap.  The controversy of no balling Murali's action has huge racist undertones, why the fact that he was Sri lankan have anything to do with it?  Hair no balled his action not his colour.  To say his umpiring against asian teams reminds me of the old saying of people in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.  The umpiring in the subcontinent before the board of interneational umpires was introduced was ghastly, one only has to remember the LBW decisions that were regularly given.  There was no chants of those being racist decisions, it was taken on the chin.  How is it not a type of match fixing to be demanding certain umpires don't officiate your games, no matter what the sport is?

I guess this rant is probably a symptom of my growing disenchantment with sport.  I am an allround sport nut, but am struggling to encourage my kids to take it up.  I can teach them the values of combat, courage, fair play and respect in life and in sport, but its so bloody hard when you see every day players and fans carrying on like wankers, shwoing no respect to umpires and fellow players.  I am highly competitive and hate to lose, but I have practiced what i preach. i have lost Grand finals and major finals in my playing days in hugely controversial circumstances, and despite the pain of coming up short after so much toil have walked off the field with my head high, shaken my opponents hands in congratulations and refused to verbally/physically remonstrate with umpires, or booting things around because of being ripped off.

I suspect the pressure of money intodays sport is a big culprit, but unfortunately the poison drips down through to the grass roots. But when you are seeing 8yo kids getting stuck into the refs you know there is something wrong.

I am really interested to see hwat you guys think, am I being overly pessimistic?  This whole incident has just put me off cricket.  I think the amount of drug busts in sport lately has added to my sport melencholy!  http://www.users.on.net/~acoombe/blue.gif

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 Alex
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  Posted 22/08/2006 05:13:50 PM
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Redemption of modern sport will be through people like you dave, raising the next generation of humble players who play the sport with respect and a profound love of the game and the best characteristics that competition brings out.

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 Ian
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 Ian
  Posted 22/08/2006 07:02:18 PM
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I truly echo your sentiments in relation to many sports Dave and think that sportsmanship in general is poor.

However, I do have a markedly different view to yours on this specific incident.  This wasn't a controversial decision or cock-up like some in the World Cup - this was just an occasion when 2 men, the umpires (with little or no evidence it seems) made a determination that a team cheated.  Not an opinion on a potential penalty or free kick, not a dubious angle 'I didn't quite see it properly' thing.  They told the team that they were cheats.

I have no problem with the Pakistani team protest though it is undoubted that the whole situation could have been handled better by the umps, ICC, cricket boards and the pakistani team.  I am not saying that Darryl Hair is racist but there have clearly been a number of issues involving him that then leave him open to accusations.

I am not a racist, though I have been accused of it by one of our doctors which was very unpleasant.  Most of our doctors are asians and I live in a city where there is a large asian population and I would never treat them differently (positive discrimination or whatever the do-gooders call it is just as bad as negative discrimination) but you do at least need to be aware of their beliefs and cultural issues around this.  Clearly, these umpires aren't.

Overall just a very unfortunate course of events.  And this in a series where the relations between the teams have been good.  My last comment - if they were going to cheat why would they do it when they were in a great position in the game and almost certain to win?  Just don't see it and no tangible evidence that it happened.  Ump's decision is final but they have to be able to demonstrate (as you do in legal forums) that you have been 'reasonable'.  Are they able to demonstrate this?  If so, we need to be made aware of the evidence.  The fact that we haven't been makes me wonder.

No offence at your comments Dave, just my honest opinion on events.

Kind rgds, Ian

 Fles
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 Fles
  Posted 23/08/2006 02:18:47 AM
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Thanks Alex for your kind comments, although you have seen me banished from a game of mixed netball for politley asking the ref twice to protect our fellow 4ft nothing female team-mates from a phsical battering in a game that was supposedly non contact (this while our 4ft wing attack was laying prone on the floor after she was basically sacked and then had to blindly feel the floor for her spectacles).  They call Darrel Hair strict and officious, he had nothing on this ref.  She probably would have had me knee capped if I spoke any other way than nicely. :-)

Absolutely no offence taken at all Ian, i really do appreciate you taking the time to give your thoughts.

I guess my point is that the umpires are the adjudicators of the game, and must call things as they see it.  They are completely in their rights to penalize any team that they deem to be cheating, just not sure how the race issue is made with it.  Pakistan are fully in their rights to argue their defence, it doesn't matter where you come from being labelled a cheat is an offence.  But things must go through the right channels.  As i said before, how many of the world Cup football games were decided on thge scoreboard by cheating?  there were no walkoffs or teams sitting in the rooms for most of the second half. It sets a very dangerous precedent.

I really don't see how the culture of nations should come into how one umpires a cricket game.  Its another case of political correctness gone mad.  Their is the same basic set of rules for everyone, otherwise you don't have a game.

If Pakistan didn't cheat, then why not leave it to the end of the day to be proved right.  With them in such a powerful position as you said, what was for them to lose by playing the day out.  Whether they are proved to have cheated or not, Inzy and the Pakistan management have forced the hand.  I am not totally surprised by the mayhem that followed, who would have been prepared for it?

Lots of people have labeled Hair a racist or treated asian cricketers differently, but where is the evidence?  No balling Murali?  What does his skin colour have to do with it?  I think there is a xenophobia towards Hair that in itself is absolutely racist.  All there has been is a lot of hollow talk with out much to back it up.  unfortunately the media pick up on it and before you know it becomes fact.

All in all i would be disgusted if Ricky Ponting pulled the same stunt.  I don't have a problem with Inzy arguing his defence on the field in a professional manner, but when does an ump ever change their mind?  Then leave it to after stumps to be proved or disproved.  There is no dignity in sulking in the dressing rooms.
As Steve Waugh said today, NO ONE is bigger than the game.  

--Last edited by Fles on 2006-08-23 03:19:55 --

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 Ian
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 Ian
  Posted 23/08/2006 03:16:16 AM
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I don't necessarily understand the reaction myself and if I personally was that angry then I would have taken my team off there and then.  I suppose the point I am making (and this is a learned thing from my job and where I live) is that different communities think very differently.  I don't always understand it but I have grown to try and accept it and compromise where compromise is reasonable.

Hair doesn't strike me as someone who would ever compromise on anything.  That doesn't make him a racist - just stubborn.  He doesn't understand the way they think and behave in relation to his actions - and that's not because of the colour of their skin.  I'm not saying he's necessarily wrong to be that way but I am by nature more inclined to compromise and would have handled the situation differently myself.

I would also say that it may have just been a build-up of frustration in general.  Pakistan have had some awful umpiring decisions go against them in this series.

Kind rgds, Ian


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